Why do people always have to preface things by saying something like “I don’t agree with Israel all the time“? I mean, I don’t agree with myself all the time! Why do they have to state the obvious? I don’t agree with my own country all the time, so what? I’m a patriot nonetheless and a staunch supporter of the state of Israel.
What is the point here? Do I as a Jew have to explain the things that Israel does or doesn’t do that hits people the wrong way. The world would have you believe that you need to give a reason for Israel’s behavior because you are Jewish and you need to justify the existence of the state or you are somehow responsible for their perceived shortcomings. Gaslighting at its finest.
Disagreeing with Israel isn't the problem. Most readers of this Substack will certainly find ways to have substantial disagreements with the government of Israel, and I don't feel any need to defend settlement policy or the proposed judicial reforms, for example. But the core of anti-Israel arguments is the double standard: "Israel does X [note that this may not even be true] and therefore the Jewish people have lost their rights to national self-determination, and must be dispossessed of their homeland". That argument is never made about countries with exponentially more concerning human rights records (see under: China, Iran, Pakistan, North Korea, Russia, Yemen, Sudan). The more radical ones will take it a step further: "Therefore, because the great majority of Jews here support Israel. this justifies harassment and violence against Diaspora Jews an their community institutions." And so, by insisting that acceptance of Jews in the Diaspora is conditional, they ironically demonstrate the necessity of Israel for Jewish survival.
What a sad thing for you not to admit you’re Israeli. It’s one thing to disagree with one’s country, it’s another thing to hide like a coward from the only democracy in the Middle East and a country that has given so much to the world through science, medicine, tech, environmentalism etc. You’re a one of those ‘as a Jew’ people. You’ve clearly bought the Qatari propaganda that’s been working 24/7. Unlike you, I am not a Jew with trembling knees. And G-d willing when I get my Israeli citizenship, I won’t hide and be spineless like you. Israel’s in an existential war, I guess you forgot what happened on 7/10. I’m a loud and proud Zionist Jew who can criticise Israel without the pathetic behaviour you recommend.
It seems to me that non-Jews have many of us believing we need to defend every action Israel takes. I'm a diaspora Jew who's never been to Israel, and I realized some time ago it's not my job to insist on Israel's perfection, or even to demand it be perfect myself.
What's actually appalling is those non-Jews scouring Israel's actions for any sign of wrongdoing. Sometimes they point to real evidence of imperfection, but they also cling to falsities to avoid truth that's more complex, exonerating, or even a sign of Jewish righteousness and our accusers' moral failures. They don't care about wrongdoing elsewhere in the world. Maybe they give it lip service or try to distract us with complaints about money or "that's whataboutism," but those are no full explanation for an obsessive focus on Israel and neutral or positive talk about other peoples and places despite their own appalling histories and present-day atrocities. Those choices aren't a referendum on us: They're telling on themselves, trying to push down fears and feelings of responsibility for their own societies' failings by hyper-focusing on the Jews, as though this time the world's repeated bigotry is finally justified.
Jews don't owe the world perfection. Bibi owes his own citizens governance that isn't corrupt and self-serving. The IDF owes its enemies at least attempting to avoid unnecessary cruelty. Some of Israel's actions are bad. Plenty are good enough, understandable in context for anyone who isn't looking for reasons to hate a whole country. And I'm happy to share what I know with non-Jews who are honestly looking to understand Jews and this conflict better, because I do think that's better than the alternative. But I firmly believe it's not my job to agree with or defend everything Israel does, and anyone asking me to do that is the real problem here.
I do not need to either defend or reject to outsiders ANYTHING Israel does. We all have opinions and we can agree or disagree with a particular Israeli government or policy. As Zionists we must unconditionally stand behind Israel in its lonely fight for survival. We do NOT make common cause with the Jew haters and Israel bashers. We do NOT agree with them or apologize to them or tell them "Well I don't agree with what Israel does." We keep our arguments within. We do not give aid and comfort to our enemies. Needless to say I disagree with your entire premise and actually find it outrageous in this time of all times.
I doubt Russians abroad feel the need to explain themselves or apologize for their government even as Russia is waging a war of conquest and imperialism, not one of self-defense and survival.
This sounds more like a statement of your own cowardice and ghetto Jew mentality rather than on Israel. Your response is to retreat in the face of the tsunami of lies and blood libels. Again, you don't say what exactly you are ashamed of or how you think Israel is wrong in Gaza. If anything, I see a nation which has gone above and beyond, unprecedented in the history of warfare to feed and protect the enemy population after a brutal, barbaric massacre of its people. Any other country under the same circumstances would have ruthlessly attacked the "palestinians" like Jordan once did.
"And yet, the other day, when a salesman asked where I’m from, I said, “all over.” Accurate, but not true. The truth was that I was afraid to say Israel. Afraid, even, to say Jewish. That’s what happens when a brand flips from badge to liability: It changes not only how others see you, but how you choose to present yourself".
They don't want a Palestinian they want an Islamic State. There is no plurality here. They have erased every non Muslim who ever lived in Ottoman or Caliphate 'Palestine'. They separated themselves from diversity, they ghettoed themselves, in the same way as they lived under the Ottomans.
It sounds like abandonment is exactly what you're arguing for. That you don't have to agree with the Israeli government all the time goes without saying. But its conduct in Gaza is NOT one of those things to criticize unless you make the argument that Israel has foolishly dragged out the war and sacrificed its own soldiers to protect Gazans. But I'm sure that's not what you mean. Why of all times after October 7 have you chosen to distance yourself from Israel when it most needs support? You sound less like a principled critic than a frightened Jew with trembling knees who's more concerned about protecting yourself when traveling abroad. This is the most demoralizing article I've ever read on this site.
Laura, how should Israel have responded to this if not to fire back and to enter Gaza on the ground? Keep in mind, the reason for pretty much all the casualties is that Hamas militarized civilian locations and put civilians in the direct line of fire including hospital patients and doctors.
I believe Israel will have to account for the civilian damages and lost life. More Intel will be released eventually. Well know more later. I do not believe there's genocide. I believe there is a case for Democide ie Palestinian leadership deliberately put their civilians in harm's way and I think it was Hazrallah who literally called for 'more Palestinian deaths'.
I don't exactly know where you are getting this impression. I absolutely support Israel having gone on the ground in Gaza and am aware that hamas is entirely responsible for casualties. Perhaps you confused me with another commenter.
The great majority of Jews in the Anglo sphere pay lip service to "support for Israel. BUT....not (allegedly,) Israel's targeting of children....(alleged) famine.....alleged alleged alleged alleged but for Sanders and Jon Stewart and Sarah Silverman all undeniably crimes of the Zionist state. And folks just nod along. How is this TIKKUN OLAM? Instead vote for Mamdani and show how irrelevant Israel is to you....especially in the face of our out (alleged) authoritarian, terrorist dictatorship which is dragging five year olds old of hiding closets like Elian Gonzalez with weapons pointed at him and torn from his parents to a gulag in the middle of the everglades.....so only Muriel Bowser, sonny Hostin, b. sanders and e. warren can save us. and mamdani.
What exactly is Israel doing that's indefensible? If anything, my criticism of Israel is that it's been far too generous towards the Gazan population which participated in October 7 and the ones who didn't directly participate cheered it and virtually the entire population has a nazi-like hatred for Jews.
As a Catholic I think you Jewish folks need to unify all over the world. With such a small number in the global population that seems an imperative to me. If pogroms, the Holocaust and endless wars of defense don't generate said unity than the alternative isn't very savory, yes? As an American I don't always agree with the US government but as Stephen Decataur said in 1816 “Our country! In her intercourse with foreign nations may she always be in the right; but our country, right or wrong!”
"Rockefeller Republican", i.e. a liberal and anti-Zionist. Why is it that only the Jewish people are supposed to sacrifice the lives of their own people to protect their enemies? What you describe as not crossing a moral line actually amounts to suicide. This is the game being played to create such a standard of wartime conduct as to make it impossible for Israel to defend itself and which only applies to Israel. When NATO fights wars, civilian fatalities are called "collateral damage". When civilians are killed in Israeli's wars, it's called "genocide". And that's even with hamas embedding itself within civilian populations and infrastructure. The bottom line is that you don't want Israel to have the ability to defend itself. You also want interfaith marriage so as to demographically destroy Israel as a Jewish nation. The most diabolical thing is that you pretend to be a Christian Zionist while supporting ideas which will make Israel unmoored from its Jewish identity at best, at worst that it be destroyed militarily.
We don't need to be humble; we need to stand up for ourselves and call out the BS lies and blood libels. Israel hasn't crossed a moral line; in fact, the opposite is true. The population has a nazi-like hatred of Jews and desires our genocide. Yet Israel has protected and fed this population after it slaughtered, raped and kidnapped thousands of its people. Tell me what other nation under the same circumstances wouldn't have already brutally and ruthlessly conquered and destroyed them. With friends like you...
Why do people always have to preface things by saying something like “I don’t agree with Israel all the time“? I mean, I don’t agree with myself all the time! Why do they have to state the obvious? I don’t agree with my own country all the time, so what? I’m a patriot nonetheless and a staunch supporter of the state of Israel.
So true. Of a piece with the gratuitous, prefatory phrase, “Israel is not perfect…” This immediately places the speaker in a weak, defensive posture.
I agree. It’s like they are ashamed or feel the need to apologize for being pro-Israel.
What is the point here? Do I as a Jew have to explain the things that Israel does or doesn’t do that hits people the wrong way. The world would have you believe that you need to give a reason for Israel’s behavior because you are Jewish and you need to justify the existence of the state or you are somehow responsible for their perceived shortcomings. Gaslighting at its finest.
Survival is not gentle. In fact, all Nations have practiced both in their Histories. Israel is and should be no different.
Disagreeing with Israel isn't the problem. Most readers of this Substack will certainly find ways to have substantial disagreements with the government of Israel, and I don't feel any need to defend settlement policy or the proposed judicial reforms, for example. But the core of anti-Israel arguments is the double standard: "Israel does X [note that this may not even be true] and therefore the Jewish people have lost their rights to national self-determination, and must be dispossessed of their homeland". That argument is never made about countries with exponentially more concerning human rights records (see under: China, Iran, Pakistan, North Korea, Russia, Yemen, Sudan). The more radical ones will take it a step further: "Therefore, because the great majority of Jews here support Israel. this justifies harassment and violence against Diaspora Jews an their community institutions." And so, by insisting that acceptance of Jews in the Diaspora is conditional, they ironically demonstrate the necessity of Israel for Jewish survival.
What a sad thing for you not to admit you’re Israeli. It’s one thing to disagree with one’s country, it’s another thing to hide like a coward from the only democracy in the Middle East and a country that has given so much to the world through science, medicine, tech, environmentalism etc. You’re a one of those ‘as a Jew’ people. You’ve clearly bought the Qatari propaganda that’s been working 24/7. Unlike you, I am not a Jew with trembling knees. And G-d willing when I get my Israeli citizenship, I won’t hide and be spineless like you. Israel’s in an existential war, I guess you forgot what happened on 7/10. I’m a loud and proud Zionist Jew who can criticise Israel without the pathetic behaviour you recommend.
It seems to me that non-Jews have many of us believing we need to defend every action Israel takes. I'm a diaspora Jew who's never been to Israel, and I realized some time ago it's not my job to insist on Israel's perfection, or even to demand it be perfect myself.
What's actually appalling is those non-Jews scouring Israel's actions for any sign of wrongdoing. Sometimes they point to real evidence of imperfection, but they also cling to falsities to avoid truth that's more complex, exonerating, or even a sign of Jewish righteousness and our accusers' moral failures. They don't care about wrongdoing elsewhere in the world. Maybe they give it lip service or try to distract us with complaints about money or "that's whataboutism," but those are no full explanation for an obsessive focus on Israel and neutral or positive talk about other peoples and places despite their own appalling histories and present-day atrocities. Those choices aren't a referendum on us: They're telling on themselves, trying to push down fears and feelings of responsibility for their own societies' failings by hyper-focusing on the Jews, as though this time the world's repeated bigotry is finally justified.
Jews don't owe the world perfection. Bibi owes his own citizens governance that isn't corrupt and self-serving. The IDF owes its enemies at least attempting to avoid unnecessary cruelty. Some of Israel's actions are bad. Plenty are good enough, understandable in context for anyone who isn't looking for reasons to hate a whole country. And I'm happy to share what I know with non-Jews who are honestly looking to understand Jews and this conflict better, because I do think that's better than the alternative. But I firmly believe it's not my job to agree with or defend everything Israel does, and anyone asking me to do that is the real problem here.
I do not need to either defend or reject to outsiders ANYTHING Israel does. We all have opinions and we can agree or disagree with a particular Israeli government or policy. As Zionists we must unconditionally stand behind Israel in its lonely fight for survival. We do NOT make common cause with the Jew haters and Israel bashers. We do NOT agree with them or apologize to them or tell them "Well I don't agree with what Israel does." We keep our arguments within. We do not give aid and comfort to our enemies. Needless to say I disagree with your entire premise and actually find it outrageous in this time of all times.
I doubt Russians abroad feel the need to explain themselves or apologize for their government even as Russia is waging a war of conquest and imperialism, not one of self-defense and survival.
This sounds more like a statement of your own cowardice and ghetto Jew mentality rather than on Israel. Your response is to retreat in the face of the tsunami of lies and blood libels. Again, you don't say what exactly you are ashamed of or how you think Israel is wrong in Gaza. If anything, I see a nation which has gone above and beyond, unprecedented in the history of warfare to feed and protect the enemy population after a brutal, barbaric massacre of its people. Any other country under the same circumstances would have ruthlessly attacked the "palestinians" like Jordan once did.
................................................................................................................................................................................................
"And yet, the other day, when a salesman asked where I’m from, I said, “all over.” Accurate, but not true. The truth was that I was afraid to say Israel. Afraid, even, to say Jewish. That’s what happens when a brand flips from badge to liability: It changes not only how others see you, but how you choose to present yourself".
They don't want a Palestinian they want an Islamic State. There is no plurality here. They have erased every non Muslim who ever lived in Ottoman or Caliphate 'Palestine'. They separated themselves from diversity, they ghettoed themselves, in the same way as they lived under the Ottomans.
It sounds like abandonment is exactly what you're arguing for. That you don't have to agree with the Israeli government all the time goes without saying. But its conduct in Gaza is NOT one of those things to criticize unless you make the argument that Israel has foolishly dragged out the war and sacrificed its own soldiers to protect Gazans. But I'm sure that's not what you mean. Why of all times after October 7 have you chosen to distance yourself from Israel when it most needs support? You sound less like a principled critic than a frightened Jew with trembling knees who's more concerned about protecting yourself when traveling abroad. This is the most demoralizing article I've ever read on this site.
................................................................................................................................................................................................
"A post-October 7th Jewish identity has to be something else. I’m not arguing for abandonment",
Laura, how should Israel have responded to this if not to fire back and to enter Gaza on the ground? Keep in mind, the reason for pretty much all the casualties is that Hamas militarized civilian locations and put civilians in the direct line of fire including hospital patients and doctors.
I believe Israel will have to account for the civilian damages and lost life. More Intel will be released eventually. Well know more later. I do not believe there's genocide. I believe there is a case for Democide ie Palestinian leadership deliberately put their civilians in harm's way and I think it was Hazrallah who literally called for 'more Palestinian deaths'.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Palestinian_rocket_attacks_on_Israel_in_2023
Shortly afterward rocket fire came from Hezbollah and the Houthis
My only criticism of the Gaza war is that Israel has risked its own soldiers to avoid collateral damage.
I don't exactly know where you are getting this impression. I absolutely support Israel having gone on the ground in Gaza and am aware that hamas is entirely responsible for casualties. Perhaps you confused me with another commenter.
The great majority of Jews in the Anglo sphere pay lip service to "support for Israel. BUT....not (allegedly,) Israel's targeting of children....(alleged) famine.....alleged alleged alleged alleged but for Sanders and Jon Stewart and Sarah Silverman all undeniably crimes of the Zionist state. And folks just nod along. How is this TIKKUN OLAM? Instead vote for Mamdani and show how irrelevant Israel is to you....especially in the face of our out (alleged) authoritarian, terrorist dictatorship which is dragging five year olds old of hiding closets like Elian Gonzalez with weapons pointed at him and torn from his parents to a gulag in the middle of the everglades.....so only Muriel Bowser, sonny Hostin, b. sanders and e. warren can save us. and mamdani.
What exactly is Israel doing that's indefensible? If anything, my criticism of Israel is that it's been far too generous towards the Gazan population which participated in October 7 and the ones who didn't directly participate cheered it and virtually the entire population has a nazi-like hatred for Jews.
..................................................................................................................................................................................
"It’s not our job to defend the indefensible with bogus facts or weaponized accusations".
As a Catholic I think you Jewish folks need to unify all over the world. With such a small number in the global population that seems an imperative to me. If pogroms, the Holocaust and endless wars of defense don't generate said unity than the alternative isn't very savory, yes? As an American I don't always agree with the US government but as Stephen Decataur said in 1816 “Our country! In her intercourse with foreign nations may she always be in the right; but our country, right or wrong!”
"Rockefeller Republican", i.e. a liberal and anti-Zionist. Why is it that only the Jewish people are supposed to sacrifice the lives of their own people to protect their enemies? What you describe as not crossing a moral line actually amounts to suicide. This is the game being played to create such a standard of wartime conduct as to make it impossible for Israel to defend itself and which only applies to Israel. When NATO fights wars, civilian fatalities are called "collateral damage". When civilians are killed in Israeli's wars, it's called "genocide". And that's even with hamas embedding itself within civilian populations and infrastructure. The bottom line is that you don't want Israel to have the ability to defend itself. You also want interfaith marriage so as to demographically destroy Israel as a Jewish nation. The most diabolical thing is that you pretend to be a Christian Zionist while supporting ideas which will make Israel unmoored from its Jewish identity at best, at worst that it be destroyed militarily.
We don't need to be humble; we need to stand up for ourselves and call out the BS lies and blood libels. Israel hasn't crossed a moral line; in fact, the opposite is true. The population has a nazi-like hatred of Jews and desires our genocide. Yet Israel has protected and fed this population after it slaughtered, raped and kidnapped thousands of its people. Tell me what other nation under the same circumstances wouldn't have already brutally and ruthlessly conquered and destroyed them. With friends like you...