The West has convinced itself, against all evidence, that the Palestinians are fighting for their own state — and that creating one will bring peace. Spoiler: It won't.
Finally, at Torah Study at our Reconstructionist Synagogue in Pacific Palisades, our Rabbi started ranting about our country’s problems brought on by the Progressives on the far left! There have been no discussions for 8 months! What has been happening here? I sent her many articles and pod casts. I will say she is very consumed with the large congregation. Everyone is very worried as they continue to read The NY Times and listen to NPR. I tried to say something about the media here being biased 8 months ago. No one picked up on it. I tried to talk about the changes in curriculum in the last 30 years (I was a curriculum developer before that time) no one picked up on it. People have their heads in the sand or just don’t care. How anyone could want another state filled with terrorists is beyond me. Thank you for continuing to make us smarter, don’t give up.
Well, your Rabbi is not likely to remain a Rabbi there long if he's not drinking the kool-aid anymore. I was a member of a Reconstructionist Synagogue briefly in 2002. I wrote articles for their newsletter. But when they asked me to write a celebratory piece about the United Nations, not only did I refuse- I quit the congregation. The rabbi there (who, BTW, wrote his own siddur containing poems from Leonard Cohen!) was offended when I told him his shul was anti-Israel. But I guess I was in good company. His son flaunted his dad's wishes by making Aliyah and joining the IDF!
Hello Susan, I always like reading your comments. I think a lot has changed since 2002 in the Reconstructionist synagogues. We love and support Israel. People adore our woman Rabbi and accept her the way she is because she is brilliant, loving and compassionate. She is also funny and loves to dance. In fact, I met her on the dance floor at a wedding she performed. I also love to dance! She says a lot of things out of nowhere like being surprised about Progressives and the left. She has been on the left and always says we have people in the synagogue who are different politically. Anyway, maybe this will lead to more openness and discussions. As far as figuring out where the Palestinians should go, I believe no countries want to take them in. And, good for the Rabbi’s son. Have a lovely evening wherever you are.
I’m a former Catholic and have been progressive for years. What the hell was I thinking? If Republicans weren’t fascists I’d be tempted to vote for them. I just received my US/Israeli flag pin in the mail and will proudly wear it. If I’m beaten up by the hard-leftist thugs, it will be worth it. I’m not a fan of Muslims and no one will ever shame me again for that. I’m truly sorry for my role in supporting Bernie Sanders.
Don’t feel bad Julia, we were young and impressionable. I worked hard to get Obama elected and look where that got us!! Republicans are not all fascists. May I suggest you check out The Good Fellows from Stanford. They have informative videos about 1x/month and Victor Davis Hansen’s writings for a dose of reality, hard to take but he knows everything. Good luck🍀🍀🍀🍀🍀🍀🍀🍀🍀
Again, your joint analysis is right on the mark. It seems that the leaders of global community are handicapped by a severe case of uncurable, cognitive dissonance. The facts on the ground don't matter. Only short term, self-serving political expediency, appeasement, ignorance and topped off with a good dose of anti-Semitism.
The West's insane behavior isn't really surprising. The Leftist mindset makes a number of basic counter-factual assumptions: that everyone ultimately has the same values (other than the evil far-right, of course), that all non-whites are oppressed by whites, that Israelis are white and Palestinians are persons of color, and that the way to understand others is to imagine yourselves acting as they do.
The Leftist then thinks about what it would take for him to engage in rape and terror and concludes that Israel must be oppressing them unbelievably - as there is no other reason that said leftist (and therefore every Palestinians) would do such a thing.
As always, I appreciate your compelling historical nuggets. So the Kuwaitis kicked out hundreds of thousands of Palestinians when they supported Iraq’s 1990 invasion into Kuwait? Then why the heck are we still allowing them to occupy Gaza, Judea and Samaria? Don’t tell me it’s because we are “morally superior” to the Kuwaitis. Our own Torah tells us not to tolerate violent goyim in our midst. One of our goals must be to exile the Palestinians. Anyone have any suggestions how? Put on your thinking caps, folks.
I think the main challenge is defining a real alternative (not numerous alternatives) and gathering support for it. Right now, no one has offered a better idea (just to clarify, I’m not in favor of a 2-state solution) but it’s clear maintaining the status quo isn’t a good answer. We need a roadmap to some future long term solution and a plan to get there. Right now the politicians haven’t got another path to consider so the fiction continues. Let’s figure out where things really need to go and how we’re going to get there.
Exile them where? The Arab League has refused for 75 years to resettle them in their lands - and given the experience of Kuwait, Jordan and Lebanon, why would they change their minds now?
I don’t really want to get into a long battle here but this highlights the issue I raised. There’s no universe that exists where Israel can just eject 4M people from the West Bank. You can call it antisemitism if you like, but generally speaking, this isn’t how things happen in the world anymore. We need to figure out a real, implementable roadmap to a sensible future and to make the investments to get there. Right now, the best idea on the table is to disenfranchise the Palestinians through bilateral agreements with the Gulf States and hope the Palestinians decide that peace is a better alternative or their only option. That might work but I’m not optimistic given Iran’s role in the region, US foreign policy, and how easily the Saudi deal was derailed. Hope is not the best thing to bet on. We need an actual plan on the table, presented to the world, with the work behind it to make it a success. It doesn’t matter if the world hates Israel or Jews - this is the problem that has to be solved and, like it or not, Israel is going to have to take the lead in solving it.
Yes, my "dump them in the desert" remark was wishful thinking <g> Disenfranchising them might work with a Trump administration. He was going in the right direction. 1) Defund Iran and all its proxies, including the Palestinian Authority. 2) Get rid of Islamist clergy fueling the hate. (It's not just Hamas). 3) Facilitate the Abraham Accords to begin strengthening Israel's relationship with Arab states. I also think that a combination of increasing Jewish settlement in the territories, combined with tough policing of the Pallies is called for. Like instant death for anyone preaching death/hate messages. Taking over their education system to remove current ideology of hate. Possibly some program of psycho/social rehabilitation. But dumping them in the desert should be presented as Plan B. Seriously. If Kuwait could arbitrarily expel them, the world can just shut its mouth if we're forced to.
The world must come to the understanding that under current conditions, the "two-state" solution is not a solution. Firstly, the wording itself is extremely incorrect because one state already exists and will exist, no matter how much the world resists it. This means that what they are demanding is one Arab state. That is, they are demanding a 23rd Arab state. For whom are they demanding a 23th Arab state?
For people who are not a single people and are divided into clans, families built according to the schemes of terrorist organizations and criminal clans.
For people who, in 80 years, have not agreed to the existence of a Jewish state and live in anticipation of its destruction.
For people who, in 80 years, have done nothing to build a modern civil society, traditions of statehood, immunity from the influence of foreign, religious and criminal extremists.
For people who, instead of developing their economy, are building a system of consuming international aid, which they are turning into mandatory and are not ready to refuse it.
For people who are used to not solving all the problems, but blaming Israel for them.
Those who are now proposing to give them a state (this is a gift, not the construction of a state), what are they counting on?
That this state will be independent? That it will be free and democratic? That all the listed shortcomings will disappear?
That the whole world will not continue to feed, build and invest billions in the black hole of Middle Eastern crime?
The world must understand that it has two prospects: - To forever support a non-viable state (an enclave, autonomy, or other form that it will take), to deal with their wars, civil strife, feudal traditions and an ever-growing population, the growth of which is artificially supported by international aid and the desire of Arab countries to keep them in the enclave.
And second: To resettle and assimilate into other countries and societies.
The second option will be cheaper for the whole world, will save the lives of hundreds of thousands of people, will give hope to those who want to live happily. The first option will not please Marxists, socialists, Islamists, criminals and all those who made a career on the eternal Arab-Israeli conflict
Spoiler alert: when you have a commonwealth colonial project partnering with jewish supremacists to steal land, resources, and homes of the native population, you will have to find a way to work towards Justice, or you will have no peace. But racists would rather blame the lack of peace on someones race rather than face a reality that would completely shatter your made up identities.
Our moron of a presidential candidate needs to read this. This information should be given in a state-of-the-union address which stops funding for “Palestinian “ “causes”
You betrayed Moses, Jesus (Peace Be Upon Them). You pathetic people will stay the same. Palestine will be free and you landstealers will have plenty of land in Hell. Enjoy while it lasts. Mfs
lies, israel illegally stole Palestine's land and are doing it continuously. We all know about Balford declaration, Nakba , israel's treatment to Palestinians. israel kept funding Hamas to use it as an excuse to continue their genocide.
Shame on you landstealers. Don't worry, you will have plenty of land in Hell. Enjoy while it lasts 😊
Spoiler alert: when you have a commonwealth colonial project partnering with jewish supremacists to steal land, resources, and homes of the native population, you will have to find a way to work towards Justice, or you will have no peace. But racists would rather blame the lack of peace on someones race rather than face a reality that would completely shatter your made up identities.
Sometimes the solution is difficult , but the problem is so severe that it has to be resolved.
There will never be peace with terrorists. It’s absurd to engage them at that level. I’m sure these sadistic creeps cannot believe their good fortunes to have the Western powers pitching this dumb crap. It’s unreal and infuriating to listen to the same tired arguments which have never worked. The current U.S. Administration is not on Israel’s side. They are playing both sides of this conflict, but somehow they are willing to sacrifice everybody for this retarded Iran deal, which is dangerous for the whole world, not just Israel. Obama is driving the bus and he’s a Marxist-Islamist, anti-Semite. He also hates Netanyahu. Israel needs to do what it needs to do. The West has its head up its nether regions.
That is absolutely correct, as doing so would deprive them of their biggest propaganda tool and something to complain about! It would also require complete Israeli control of all it's border crossings into Jordan and Egypt to avoid weapons smuggling, as they are professional smugglers, as they have proven in Ciudad del Este in Paraguay. A once vibrant Jewish community in Ciudad del Este has been overtaken by Palestinian smuggles and crime syndicates.
Finally, at Torah Study at our Reconstructionist Synagogue in Pacific Palisades, our Rabbi started ranting about our country’s problems brought on by the Progressives on the far left! There have been no discussions for 8 months! What has been happening here? I sent her many articles and pod casts. I will say she is very consumed with the large congregation. Everyone is very worried as they continue to read The NY Times and listen to NPR. I tried to say something about the media here being biased 8 months ago. No one picked up on it. I tried to talk about the changes in curriculum in the last 30 years (I was a curriculum developer before that time) no one picked up on it. People have their heads in the sand or just don’t care. How anyone could want another state filled with terrorists is beyond me. Thank you for continuing to make us smarter, don’t give up.
Well, your Rabbi is not likely to remain a Rabbi there long if he's not drinking the kool-aid anymore. I was a member of a Reconstructionist Synagogue briefly in 2002. I wrote articles for their newsletter. But when they asked me to write a celebratory piece about the United Nations, not only did I refuse- I quit the congregation. The rabbi there (who, BTW, wrote his own siddur containing poems from Leonard Cohen!) was offended when I told him his shul was anti-Israel. But I guess I was in good company. His son flaunted his dad's wishes by making Aliyah and joining the IDF!
Hello Susan, I always like reading your comments. I think a lot has changed since 2002 in the Reconstructionist synagogues. We love and support Israel. People adore our woman Rabbi and accept her the way she is because she is brilliant, loving and compassionate. She is also funny and loves to dance. In fact, I met her on the dance floor at a wedding she performed. I also love to dance! She says a lot of things out of nowhere like being surprised about Progressives and the left. She has been on the left and always says we have people in the synagogue who are different politically. Anyway, maybe this will lead to more openness and discussions. As far as figuring out where the Palestinians should go, I believe no countries want to take them in. And, good for the Rabbi’s son. Have a lovely evening wherever you are.
I’m a former Catholic and have been progressive for years. What the hell was I thinking? If Republicans weren’t fascists I’d be tempted to vote for them. I just received my US/Israeli flag pin in the mail and will proudly wear it. If I’m beaten up by the hard-leftist thugs, it will be worth it. I’m not a fan of Muslims and no one will ever shame me again for that. I’m truly sorry for my role in supporting Bernie Sanders.
Don’t feel bad Julia, we were young and impressionable. I worked hard to get Obama elected and look where that got us!! Republicans are not all fascists. May I suggest you check out The Good Fellows from Stanford. They have informative videos about 1x/month and Victor Davis Hansen’s writings for a dose of reality, hard to take but he knows everything. Good luck🍀🍀🍀🍀🍀🍀🍀🍀🍀
I just read about Armenia .. maybe they will be the next host for the always appreciative Palestinians ... or even Russia ... :)
Again, your joint analysis is right on the mark. It seems that the leaders of global community are handicapped by a severe case of uncurable, cognitive dissonance. The facts on the ground don't matter. Only short term, self-serving political expediency, appeasement, ignorance and topped off with a good dose of anti-Semitism.
The West's insane behavior isn't really surprising. The Leftist mindset makes a number of basic counter-factual assumptions: that everyone ultimately has the same values (other than the evil far-right, of course), that all non-whites are oppressed by whites, that Israelis are white and Palestinians are persons of color, and that the way to understand others is to imagine yourselves acting as they do.
The Leftist then thinks about what it would take for him to engage in rape and terror and concludes that Israel must be oppressing them unbelievably - as there is no other reason that said leftist (and therefore every Palestinians) would do such a thing.
As always, I appreciate your compelling historical nuggets. So the Kuwaitis kicked out hundreds of thousands of Palestinians when they supported Iraq’s 1990 invasion into Kuwait? Then why the heck are we still allowing them to occupy Gaza, Judea and Samaria? Don’t tell me it’s because we are “morally superior” to the Kuwaitis. Our own Torah tells us not to tolerate violent goyim in our midst. One of our goals must be to exile the Palestinians. Anyone have any suggestions how? Put on your thinking caps, folks.
I think the main challenge is defining a real alternative (not numerous alternatives) and gathering support for it. Right now, no one has offered a better idea (just to clarify, I’m not in favor of a 2-state solution) but it’s clear maintaining the status quo isn’t a good answer. We need a roadmap to some future long term solution and a plan to get there. Right now the politicians haven’t got another path to consider so the fiction continues. Let’s figure out where things really need to go and how we’re going to get there.
It seems obvious. Exile the Palestinians. It's just a matter of doing it once we're in a position militarily to tell the US and others "where to go".
Exile them where? The Arab League has refused for 75 years to resettle them in their lands - and given the experience of Kuwait, Jordan and Lebanon, why would they change their minds now?
Dump them in the desert. Did Kuwait worry about where they went?
I don’t really want to get into a long battle here but this highlights the issue I raised. There’s no universe that exists where Israel can just eject 4M people from the West Bank. You can call it antisemitism if you like, but generally speaking, this isn’t how things happen in the world anymore. We need to figure out a real, implementable roadmap to a sensible future and to make the investments to get there. Right now, the best idea on the table is to disenfranchise the Palestinians through bilateral agreements with the Gulf States and hope the Palestinians decide that peace is a better alternative or their only option. That might work but I’m not optimistic given Iran’s role in the region, US foreign policy, and how easily the Saudi deal was derailed. Hope is not the best thing to bet on. We need an actual plan on the table, presented to the world, with the work behind it to make it a success. It doesn’t matter if the world hates Israel or Jews - this is the problem that has to be solved and, like it or not, Israel is going to have to take the lead in solving it.
Yes, my "dump them in the desert" remark was wishful thinking <g> Disenfranchising them might work with a Trump administration. He was going in the right direction. 1) Defund Iran and all its proxies, including the Palestinian Authority. 2) Get rid of Islamist clergy fueling the hate. (It's not just Hamas). 3) Facilitate the Abraham Accords to begin strengthening Israel's relationship with Arab states. I also think that a combination of increasing Jewish settlement in the territories, combined with tough policing of the Pallies is called for. Like instant death for anyone preaching death/hate messages. Taking over their education system to remove current ideology of hate. Possibly some program of psycho/social rehabilitation. But dumping them in the desert should be presented as Plan B. Seriously. If Kuwait could arbitrarily expel them, the world can just shut its mouth if we're forced to.
The world must come to the understanding that under current conditions, the "two-state" solution is not a solution. Firstly, the wording itself is extremely incorrect because one state already exists and will exist, no matter how much the world resists it. This means that what they are demanding is one Arab state. That is, they are demanding a 23rd Arab state. For whom are they demanding a 23th Arab state?
For people who are not a single people and are divided into clans, families built according to the schemes of terrorist organizations and criminal clans.
For people who, in 80 years, have not agreed to the existence of a Jewish state and live in anticipation of its destruction.
For people who, in 80 years, have done nothing to build a modern civil society, traditions of statehood, immunity from the influence of foreign, religious and criminal extremists.
For people who, instead of developing their economy, are building a system of consuming international aid, which they are turning into mandatory and are not ready to refuse it.
For people who are used to not solving all the problems, but blaming Israel for them.
Those who are now proposing to give them a state (this is a gift, not the construction of a state), what are they counting on?
That this state will be independent? That it will be free and democratic? That all the listed shortcomings will disappear?
That the whole world will not continue to feed, build and invest billions in the black hole of Middle Eastern crime?
The world must understand that it has two prospects: - To forever support a non-viable state (an enclave, autonomy, or other form that it will take), to deal with their wars, civil strife, feudal traditions and an ever-growing population, the growth of which is artificially supported by international aid and the desire of Arab countries to keep them in the enclave.
And second: To resettle and assimilate into other countries and societies.
The second option will be cheaper for the whole world, will save the lives of hundreds of thousands of people, will give hope to those who want to live happily. The first option will not please Marxists, socialists, Islamists, criminals and all those who made a career on the eternal Arab-Israeli conflict
You landstealers will have plenty of land in Hell. Palestine will be free of illegal occupation. Enjoy while it lasts
These are the last poisonous words you will write in this forum, troll.
Keep barking B😀
The best solution!
These are the last poisonous words you will write in this forum, troll.
Give denazification a chance.
How’d this bullshit propaganda end up in my inbox. The great manipulators.
Spoiler alert: when you have a commonwealth colonial project partnering with jewish supremacists to steal land, resources, and homes of the native population, you will have to find a way to work towards Justice, or you will have no peace. But racists would rather blame the lack of peace on someones race rather than face a reality that would completely shatter your made up identities.
This is complete fake news.
Our moron of a presidential candidate needs to read this. This information should be given in a state-of-the-union address which stops funding for “Palestinian “ “causes”
You betrayed Moses, Jesus (Peace Be Upon Them). You pathetic people will stay the same. Palestine will be free and you landstealers will have plenty of land in Hell. Enjoy while it lasts. Mfs
lies, israel illegally stole Palestine's land and are doing it continuously. We all know about Balford declaration, Nakba , israel's treatment to Palestinians. israel kept funding Hamas to use it as an excuse to continue their genocide.
Shame on you landstealers. Don't worry, you will have plenty of land in Hell. Enjoy while it lasts 😊
They are fighting to become the colonizers.
Spoiler alert: when you have a commonwealth colonial project partnering with jewish supremacists to steal land, resources, and homes of the native population, you will have to find a way to work towards Justice, or you will have no peace. But racists would rather blame the lack of peace on someones race rather than face a reality that would completely shatter your made up identities.
Sometimes the solution is difficult , but the problem is so severe that it has to be resolved.
There will never be peace with terrorists. It’s absurd to engage them at that level. I’m sure these sadistic creeps cannot believe their good fortunes to have the Western powers pitching this dumb crap. It’s unreal and infuriating to listen to the same tired arguments which have never worked. The current U.S. Administration is not on Israel’s side. They are playing both sides of this conflict, but somehow they are willing to sacrifice everybody for this retarded Iran deal, which is dangerous for the whole world, not just Israel. Obama is driving the bus and he’s a Marxist-Islamist, anti-Semite. He also hates Netanyahu. Israel needs to do what it needs to do. The West has its head up its nether regions.
That is absolutely correct, as doing so would deprive them of their biggest propaganda tool and something to complain about! It would also require complete Israeli control of all it's border crossings into Jordan and Egypt to avoid weapons smuggling, as they are professional smugglers, as they have proven in Ciudad del Este in Paraguay. A once vibrant Jewish community in Ciudad del Este has been overtaken by Palestinian smuggles and crime syndicates.
People must understand that a two state solution is NOT a solution. It will lead to a terrible war that will consume Israel.